In Conversation with Paulien Osse - September 1, 2022

Feisty. Creative. Visionary. Caring. And definitely non-conforming! Paulien Osse, co-founder and General Director of the WageIndicator Foundation, has built a unique organisation focused on improving labour market transparency worldwide. With over 200 country websites in more than 50 languages, a global team of experienced journalists, data specialists, researchers, academics and labour law specialists, and a stable of enthusiastic interns, WageIndicator collects and shares crucial information on wages and work. It’s information which is freely accessible to everybody from street-cleaners to CEOs, while curated data sets assist large corporations and multinationals to make important decisions about living wages.

Paulien Osse at one of WageIndicator's conferences, in 2015

It’s big stuff – an organisation employing nearly a hundred staff, with the same amount of interns, operating across multiple countries and reaching literally millions of people. But in a way, the philosophy and ethos which forms WageIndicator was forged from small beginnings – specifically, small animals.

“When I was young and growing up in the north of the Netherlands, I started a small kind of farm at home – with goats, chickens, rabbits,” says Paulien. “In order for it to work, I had to buy and sell, and get to know farmers in the area. My parents allowed me to do this, but I had to take all the responsibility. Ultimately, I learnt that if you want something to succeed, you need to create a sustainable structure,” explains Paulien. “Also – every animal is different and has different needs. You can never generalise. And that applies to people as well.”

Politics and people

The daughter of a politician and a pharmacist who encouraged lively debate in the home, Paulien’s love of animals moved to a passion for people and politics, and she became a journalist (although it was “not seen as a suitable job for a lady” in those days, she smiles). In the beginning she wrote about poetry and literature and theatre, but was drawn to covering economic stories while travelling through southern Africa, Latin America and Turkey. She was kicked out of apartheid South Africa and was witness to much on her travels, becoming increasingly attracted to covering economic injustices.

And then yet another “small” beginning was to shape Paulien’s way of thinking: a baby. Notably, her first pregnancy with daughter Fiona – who now, in a full circle, will be joining WageIndicator’s new team of directors as General Director.

Fiona Dragstra (left) and Paulien Osse (center), next to Jan Paul Grollé, after winning an award from HiiL in 2014

“When I fell pregnant, I had male journalists coming up to me and saying ‘hey, can I have your job?’ I told them I was pregnant, not dead, and why did they think I was no longer working?” recalls Paulien. “It was my first awareness that people not only see you differently when you are pregnant, they also treat you differently.”

Fiona was born, and Paulien continued working while her child attended day care five days a week (“unusual for the time,” says Paulien). She started doing research, and wrote a handbook for working parents. When it came time to update the handbook, she had another “small” brainwave.

The roots of WageIndicator

“The internet was new then – we’re talking about 1995 – but I realised it would be much easier to put the book online and update online, than reprint each time,” explains Paulien. Following on from this, she began to convince the trade union movement in the Netherlands that websites, and working online, would be cheaper and more beneficial for getting information to their union members.

From there, grew the roots of WageIndicator. “I had seen that there was a kind of salary check for people in the Netherlands to measure their wage,” says Paulien. “But when you looked more closely, it only really applied to white, middle-class males. Where was the information for the person who cleans your house? And for women in general?”

Together with Kea Tijdens from the University of Amsterdam, the two visualised a website and salary tool that would especially work for women. Thus was born Vrouwenloonwijzer.nl (Femalewageindicator.nl) – and a partnership that has lasted 22 years strong. “The way we team up now is no different to how it was then – we debate fiercely, but we always move together,” says Paulien. With Kea as Scientific Director and Paulien as General Director, the project was expanded to include men – and then more countries.

Paulien Osse (left) and Kea Tijdens (right) in the center, surrounded by global WageIndicator team members and the Lohnspiegel team

“We started nationally, then moved into Europe, and then Latin America, Asia, Africa – in 2008 we really got wings,” says Paulien. The process was gradual, Paulien’s motto being one of common sense. “I say, if you can’t visualise it, then don’t go for it. Visualise something first – properly. And then work with the people who also see that visualisation.”

An organic process

Building up a global team has been quite an organic and perhaps unconventional process, in that Paulien and Kea prefer to work with people that really want to be doing what WageIndicator does. “It’s not like we put out a list of CV criteria and people must just tick the boxes – more that they must enjoy this work, understand it, and also share creative ideas. The more you enjoy your work, the more comes out, and the more fun you can have – even with a serious topic like labour law,” says Paulien.

She is proud of the fact that global really means global, in the case of WageIndicator Foundation. “It is Benin as well as Belgium, Uganda as well as the UK. Our work, the data we collect and the information we share, is for everybody. We are truly inclusive,” she says. “We don’t forget the people who make pancakes, and the people who sweep the street.”

What is quite remarkable is that Paulien does not ever forget her team, either. If you send her an email, Whatsapp or phone call, she will reply within minutes. Sometimes seconds. And she is always alert to what her team is doing, challenges they may be facing, and support they may need. It is very reassuring, and the mark of true leadership, but Paulien shrugs it off. “Of course one must be there – if somebody knocks on your door, you open it. If there is an issue, you are an ear. If you do not do this, you are not a good boss,” she explains. “It’s also about being fair. Why should someone have a horrifying work life when they can have a nice working life?”

"If you had told me ten years ago that we would be taking in 100 interns at a time, I would have said it was impossible."

Financial responsibility

She does feel the weight of being responsible for many staff – which means their families, too. “The financial part is the hardest part – making sure there is money for the organisation for the next year. So many people are relying on this,” she admits.

But it’s overlaid with the satisfaction at what has been achieved over the past two decades. “Kea and I couldn’t have dreamt this, because nobody could have predicted how the internet would grow, what would happen. But we have always proceeded gradually – one step, look around, one step, look around. Halfway across, we realised that so much was actually possible. And we went for it,” she smiles. “It’s also about being open to changes – if you had told me ten years ago that we would be taking in 100 interns at a time, I would have said it was impossible. Now, the interns that join us are an integral part of what we do, and they make us flourish!”

WageIndicator Foundation is set to flourish for a very long time to come, with the legacy that Paulien and Kea have put in place settled on a firm foundation. From small things come big dreams – and if you’re Paulien Osse, an even bigger reality.

WageIndicator Foundation is in an exciting stage of leadership transition. Check out our news story on this transition.